Curse

Necromas · Jun 09, 2009, 06:58 PM // 18:58

I am completely new to dervish and have been thinking about doing a strength of honor PvE build (especially since it got that nice buff). This is for both hero and player use but mostly hero.

Mysticism: 10 +1 +1
Scythe Mastery: 11 +1
Smiting Prayers: 10

Skills: Mystic Sweep, Eremite's Attack, Chilling Victory, Zealous Renewal, Heart of Fury, Avatar of Grenth, Strength of Honor, Resurrection Signet

[build prof=D/Mo pve scy=10+1+1 mys=11+1 smi=10][Mystic Sweep][Eremite's Attack][Chilling Victory][Zealous Renewal][Heart of Fury][Avatar of Grenth][Strength of Honor][Resurrection Signet][/build]
*I know the GWBBCode is disabled but this is for when it gets fixed

For a weapon I'd use the Icy Soulbreaker of Enchanting or an equivalent weapon with a different snathe to make the most out of Heart of Fury and the fact that the dervish should always be under enchantments.

While Avatar of Grenth and Strength of Honor are up, each auto attack will deal an extra 18 damage and stealth 17 life. The scythe attacks are pretty standard fare and I have heard the heroes will use Chilling Victory fairly intelligently. With Heart of Fury you get 33% IAS most of the time and Zealous Renewal will help with energy management and power Mystic Sweep and Mysticism. Enemies that only remove 1 enchant at a time shouldn't be too much trouble because they'd mostly remove Zealous Renewal but obviously the build is vulnerable to areas with a lot of enchantment removal.

How do you think the build would work out? Are there any AI problems a hero running this build would face? What other Strength of Honor builds would you suggest? I haven't actually tried it yet cause I haven't acquired all the skills.

MercenaryKnight · Jun 09, 2009, 07:20 PM // 19:20

Pumping 10 points in smite for a single skill doesn't make sense. If you really want to use it try bringing a smiter hero and have them cast it on you.

I am curious to see how buffed up people could get if you ran spirit's strength/ vow of strength dervishes or ritualists along with all the buffs like strength of honor and vampiric orders. I believe 2 rit/dervishes with spirit's strength and greater dwarf weapons to cast on each other with their 2 other pve skills did like 170-200 damage with their scythe attacks by themselves.

Necromas · Jun 09, 2009, 07:34 PM // 19:34

Eh, I didn't want to have to rely on a smite hero or anything like that, and I think the smiting prayers makes sense for +18 armor ignoring damage on every single attack, it's like getting a ton of extra mystic sweeps and you can still use your attack skills at the same time.

Dervishes could definitely get some ridiculous numbers using greater dwarf weapon but I really don't like using the more overpowered PvE skills.

FoxBat · Jun 09, 2009, 08:00 PM // 20:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by MercenaryKnight

Pumping 10 points in smite for a single skill doesn't make sense.

The numbers on SoH are ridiculous now. It's stronger than doing the same with conjure element. Better if you can stack both though.

reaper with no name · Jun 09, 2009, 08:16 PM // 20:16

As MercenaryKnight. You'd be better off having a hero cast it on you. You'd be able to save a skill slot, and a lot of attribute points.

How about this: run a conjure frost build (I'm assuming you either don't have factions or don't want to bother with getting/grinding AoHM, since it's practically a requirement on most dervish builds) and bring a smiting monk to cast Strength of Honor on you. You'll get even more bonus out of the skill, because they'll have higher smiting.

Also, zealous renewal is bad. Even with HoF, you'll only get about 10 net energy total. A better form of energy management would be to take those 10 points you were going to use on SoH and put a couple of them into Wind Prayers to get Attacker's Insight (great for fueling Chilling Victory).

And if you were going to go D/Mo, why would you bring resurrection signet, when you could bring Rebirth? Heck, why would you bring resurrection signet at all regardless, since as a Nightfall character you'll be able to get Sunspear Rebirth Signet (which is literally a better version of resurrection signet)? Of course, that last part is only for when you're using it as a player. But the Rebirth thing is true even for AI.

Also, if you want to run an avatar as a player, you need Eternal Aura. Otherwise, you won't be able to maintain your avatar.

The next thing I want to mention is that AoG...well, it isn't really that good. Even with it you're not going to outtank or outdamage a sin or warrior, so why bother? If you want to be a good dervish (read: not redundant), you need to have something that warriors and sins can't do. Your advantage is that you get scythe mastery without burning your secondary profession. So use your secondary profession to get something that warriors and sins can't.

By the way, Great Dwarf Weapon is ally-only.

Necromas · Jun 09, 2009, 08:18 PM // 20:18

SoH vs. Conjure X

- SoH does more damage now.
- SoH does not require you to do elemental damage with your weapon, so you have freedom to switch weapons to the most preferable damage type, especially important if working with skills such as barbs that require physical damage. (though this point doesn't apply to my build since it uses Avatar of Grenth)
- SoH does not need to be recast unless it is removed.

However...

- Conjures only cost energy when you cast them.
- Conjures have no maintenance cost.

If you can afford the energy, SoH is clearly a stronger skill, unless you have a build that relies on other elementalist skills.

reaper with no name · Jun 09, 2009, 08:21 PM // 20:21

Conjure is also armor-ignoring.

Strength of honor can also be cast on you by allies, allies who will have higher smiting than you do. So

Conjure + Ally*SoH > Self*SoH

In fact...

Ally*SoH > Self*SoH

_Nihilist_ · Jun 09, 2009, 08:30 PM // 20:30

Bring SoH on a Smiter Hero. Better effect, more attribute points for you to utilize effectively.

Axel Zinfandel · Jun 09, 2009, 08:47 PM // 20:47

You forget that Conjure X is worthless, because AoHM makes your damange holy in nearly any case, and clearly AoHM > Conjure X

Helix Dreadlock · Jun 09, 2009, 09:27 PM // 21:27

Imo, use a vamp scythe and the eremites+mystic for quick and easy damage

reaper with no name · Jun 09, 2009, 09:39 PM // 21:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axel Zinfandel

You forget that Conjure X is worthless, because AoHM makes your damange holy in nearly any case, and clearly AoHM > Conjure X

Well, yes and no. At very low ranks, conjure has just as much of a damage bonus (while being armor-ignoring and having a longer duration). It's the higher ranks where it shines. But I assumed that he doesn't have factions or doesn't feel like going to the trouble of getting it, otherwise I would have expected it to have been in the original build he showed us.

MercenaryKnight · Jun 09, 2009, 11:36 PM // 23:36

By the way if you want to add the extra damage further go with avatar of lyssa. Underused elite imo because you get extra damage whenever they are activating anything and most of the time they will be using attack skills, spells or whatever. With an ias you can easily out damage grenth's added lifesteal imo.

Chthon · Jun 10, 2009, 02:18 AM // 02:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axel Zinfandel

You forget that Conjure X is worthless, because AoHM makes your damange holy in nearly any case, and clearly AoHM > Conjure X

DIng. We have a winner.